What action would you be willing to take against a foreign nation that deposed your rulers, funded dictators that committed genocide, ignored your laws and customs and mocked your culture, all the while funding your enemies with money and weapons that they used to slaughter your family and everyone you loved?

-S-

 

You do your thing and I'll do mine... What happened that day changed the World forever...

 

I completely disagree. Have you seen the Al qaeda manifesto? Item 3 in the charge against the west is that it reversed course against East Timor, by the west bringing forth a referendum on indepedance, which helped end the genocide, a genocide on par with the one in Cambodia except nobody seems to remember it. Once East Timor won their independance they became the newest member of the UN. Bin Laden calls this an act of Christian crusaders taking control of a country away from the Muslims (a country that happens to be 97% Catholic too), an act for which the United States cannot be forgiven and must be attacked. Therefor if you don't want the US to get involved in world affairs in case you upset the Muslims, you have to let them commit genocide.

If you think America deserved the attack, then you have to be willing to permit genocide. What American would stand for that.

 

*not_secure_link*www.youtube.com/watch?v=dunKAwRN3P8

Watch it.

-S-

 

This is a simplistic hypothetical. Show me how a specific policy initiative related to OEF has made the US worse off...

 

We stand for it every single day. Have we bothered North Korea much concerning the millions that are tortured, starved and murdered there? Or how about the Chinese and their gross human rights violations? There are civil wars and genocides in Africa all the time. You never see that on Fox News.

An attack against the U.S. was inevitable given the current attitude of our leaders and the foreign policy decisions they make. Don't get me wrong, Al Quaeda is crazy, but because of the actions we've taken in regards to the Middle East, we lend credence to their claims and allow their kind of insanity to take hold.

My point is simple. To behave in the way we have and to expect no repercussions regarding it is beyond naive. Not only that, it's dangerous.

-S-

 

Here's one:

*not_secure_link*www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

The war is not entirely responsible for this, but it is a large part.

-S-

 

How quaint.

Indeed it did. And the American response to it didn't do much to correct the problem.

-S-

 

TOTAL. BULLSHIT. We did NOTHING to deserve Al Queda's attacks. It's one of the most diabolical, irrational, militant organizations in the world.

What did we do to deserve the Kenyan Embassy Bombings?

*not_secure_link*imgs.sfgate.com/c/pictures/2001/10/11/mn_tanzania.jpg

*not_secure_link*www.defraudingamerica.com/embassy_bombing__tanzania.jpg


*not_secure_link*www.nydailynews.com/img/2010/09/16/450x341-alg_kenya_bombing.jpg
​

 

Not quaint at all-being you don't me, you have no idea how I feel and think...I see you're still a big jerk-that hasn't changed... :excited:

 

Every nation undertakes debt at some point in it's history. It's not possible to get our fiscal house in order? Please. The deficit and debt can be easily addressed without drastic defense cuts. This is more of a political issue...

 

And I see you're just as vapid as you always have been. But, as you say, you do your thing, I'll do mine.

-S-

 

This is just what I'm talking about. This idea that the U.S. operates in a consequence-free environment.

-S-

 

The only way 9/11 was a consequence was in the sense that we should have been killing Al Queda militants years before 2001.

I'm not an apologist for terrorism, thank you very much....

 

This comment shows you don't know a thing about me... :laughing:

 

It's not apologetics to admit that the U.S. has a problem. And that problem is people like you in power that think we can do whatever we want to whomever we want and not have to deal with the repercussions. 9/11 was a reaction to decades of bad foreign policy decisions and political maneuvering that was completely self-serving in nature and did not once stop to consider that the people effected in these far off lands were more than statistics on a Pentagon casualty estimate.

And until we acknowledge that, it will happen again. Or the U.S. will completely collapse under the weight of it's own imperialism.

-S-

 

Your opinion is well voiced, logical in everything but logic.

 

So, that begs the question, what do you think you know about me? After all, you feel entitled to call me a jerk. By your own reasoning, I can simply say you don't know a think(sic) about me, either.

So which is it, RP? Because honestly, what am I supposed to think of someone who says something so profound as 'what happened that day changed the WORLD...'

Wow, RP. That's fucking deep. I was moved, I really was.

-S-

 

My point is 9/11 attacks would of happened regardless of any middle east policy. Western governments were in favour of the Indonesian control and occupation of East Timor, particularly the United states because of Indonesia's anti communist stance. President Gerald Ford and US secretary of state Henry Kissinger actually met with the Indonesian leader to give their support and aproval for the invasion of East Timor.
The US(amongst other western nations) shamelessly supplied weapons for the invasion and continued the support throughout the occupation. The US government actually supplied $1.1Billion in weaponary for Indonesia during the occupation between 1975 and 1995.

The very fact that the US reversed this course of funding and support for Indonesia (a muslim country) with the United Nations pushing forward a referendum of independance of East Timor ( a Roman catholic country) which they eventually won, is the THIRD most important reason out of MANY for why the US were attacked by Al qaeda on 9/11, simply because they changed their mind about their support for a muslim country that was committing genocide on catholics.

To Bin Laden this was the same as the Christian Crusaders taking countries away from Muslim control, and this is one of the reasons the US were attacked. So you can forget about the middle east stuff, 9/11 attacks would of still happened.

 

So you don't think the U.S. has a problem with it's foreign policy?

-S-